Notebook “Tingle” Sensation: What's Going On?

 

Several weeks ago, a user from notebookforums.com reported concern about voltage. That post prompted other stories from folks like Engadget and Slashdot. About a week later, Mike, who’s one of our Customer Advocate team members, responded in the thread confirming that there’s no safety hazard with the reported tingling that some notebook users are commenting on. In a follow-up, he posted another update that confirmed that the issue does not harm internal components of a notebook.

 

Before I get further into the details of this long post, wanted  you to know that we’ve heard you and we’re taking steps.  Going forward, as we introduce new notebook models, 3-prong power adapters will be available. As noted below however, there are reasons why the 2-prong adapter is the current industry standard. 

 

3-Prong Power Adapter Survey

For existing customers, we’re currently investigating creating a program to make 3-prong power adapters available for purchase at a discounted price. We need your help, and that’s why we’re asking customers who are interested in acquiring a 3-prong power adapter to provide additional feedback via this survey on Dell.com. The survey will run from now until Monday, May 7.

 

Update 5/8: Thanks to all of you who completed the survey. Unfortunately, in the survey, we neglected to obtain contact information from you. If you completed the survey and are interested in receiving a 3-prong power adapter for a discounted price, please submit a comment to this thread and include your e-mail address. I will not publish your comment. Instead, we will e-mail you details on how to order your discounted 3-prong power adapter. We apologize for the inconvenience.


 

Because we have been shipping 2-prong adapters with the majority of our systems on a global basis for over a year now, we don’t have a ready supply of extra 3-prong adapters available. We must work with a vendor to develop a production cycle and ramp up supply.

 

Frankly, right now we are trying to estimate global demand, which will directly impact our ability to deliver a solution in a timely manner. Your feedback will help us get a better idea of how many customers would be interested.

 

“Tingle” Sensation Explained

For those of you who really want a better understanding of what the reported “tingle” sensation is, we have worked with our electrical engineers and safety teams to share a detailed description of what exactly is going on.

 

Here are some things that about the “tingle” sensation that Mike posted earlier that I think bear repeating:

  • It is not harmful to you the user.
  • It is not harmful to any of the system’s internal components.
  • This issue is not specific to Dell.
  • This issue is not specific to notebook computers even. A “tingle” sensation may be felt on many electronic devices that use a 2-prong AC power source under specific environmental conditions.


So, what’s this “tingle” sensation and what causes it? The “tingle” sensation is the transfer of energy from you, a 2-wire AC adapter/ system ground and contact with an earth ground. A “tingle” sensation may be felt when touching the exposed metal portions of the notebook and/or 2 -prong AC adapter when the AC adapter is plugged in. The “tingle” sensation is not an indication of a failed or defective ground.

 

To generate the “tingle” sensation, you must be earth grounded at the same time you are touching an exposed metal piece of the notebook while the notebook is plugged into the 2-prong AC adapter. The voltage will always be there when the notebook is plugged into the 2-prong adapter, but it is harmless to you as a user and the notebook itself. In fact, in the vast majority of cases, the voltage is not noticeable to you at all. Certain environmental elements can increase the chances of experiencing the "tingle sensation" such as weather and humidity or a person's skin condition (oily, dry, etc.) There's a bit more on this at the Dell Sweden support site.


The source of the “tingle” sensation is not your notebook, it's the 2-prong adapter. This “tingle” sensation is not caused by any defect in Dell's 2-prong adapters—they work as they are designed. Other notebook manufacturers ship with 2-prong adapters as well, and users of those notebooks may experience a “tingle” sensation if conditions are right. 2-prong adapters are becoming more common these days because they smaller, lighter and more convenient to carry—all things which are important to many notebook customers.

 

A 3-prong adapter is one option to eliminate the “tingle” sensation. The other is to change some of the environmental factors involved. As an example, the “tingle” sensation won’t happen when running the notebook on battery power. Also, you can eliminate the “tingle” sensation by connecting a grounded peripheral such as a USB printer or other device that uses a 3-prong adapter to the notebook.

 

So, how can you be sure that this issue does not cause damage to internal components? The current/voltage which results in some users feeling a “tingle” sensation does not damage the notebook because the energy flow is via the earth ground path to the chassis/AC adapter ground path. The energy does not flow through the components—they are simply not in the transmission path.

 

Several regulatory and safety agencies are in place to create and maintain standards for electronic devices. Dell meets or surpasses all applicable standards with all of our notebook and desktop systems. The logos of the applicable regulatory and safety agencies for the Dell notebook power adapters can be found on the AC adapter power brick and include the FCC, UL, CCC S&E, CSA, CE, IDA, IRAM, GS, NOM and a few others. The most important one to note will be a picture of a square within a square which indicates double insulation (2 prongs). Double-insulated refers to a safety method to protect users without an earth ground. This is done by using non conductive outer layer(s) with tight limits on current flow to earth ground. Delivering safe electronics has been a priority since Dell’s inception and we are committed to meet—and exceed—all regulatory safety requirements with our products. 

Comments  Comment RSS Feed

I'm not sure I understand this "tingle" word as a non-native english speaker. However, I've had problems with my Dell Latitude D505 laptop with power and the laptop stopping brutaly when I touched metalic parts... that I think may be related to that. You may find more details at : http://www-public.int-evry.fr/~berger_o/weblog/2005/08/23/about-my-dell-latitude-d505-poweroff-problem/ My conclusion was that one of the anti-theft attachment holes for kensigton-like cables was to be avoided (the left-side front one), and the right-hand side one was the right one to use. Hope this helps.
Adam Zey said:
This should be seen as a manufacturing defect, and 3-prong replacements should be available for FREE to any customer who calls in to complain.

The excuse about two-prong plugs taking up less space doesn't fly; the extra space required by a three-prong plug is so small that it's probably best measured in cubic millimetres! This sounds more like a cost-saving method that is now backfiring.
Jay Schlackman said:
I was happy to see the introduction of the 2-prong power supplies after endless headaches trying to replace user-damaged proprietary
Dell 3-prong power cords. If 3-prong power supplies are once again offered, does this mean this problem will also return, or are steps being taken to use the widely-used 'cloverleaf' power cords in future?
Jean-Louis Dupond said:
My screen started to give weird errors, and going black & back like 10times in 5seconds... I almost never had this problem when i connected my printer to my laptop (wich is grounded). But if I uses my laptop without ground, i got the screen problem almost always ... I think thats weird ...
Chris Lilley said:

Just as a data point re non-standard cables, the 3-prong adapter on my Dell Precision M90 uses a standard IEC C5 'cloverleaf' power cord.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_connector 

Lionel Menchaca, Chief Blogger said:

Adam: thanks for your comment.

The plain truth is that it's not a manufacturing defect. It is not specific to Dell and it's not even specfic to notebooks themselves. Like I mentioned in the post, a tingle sensation may be felt on many electronic devices that use a 2-prong AC power source under specific environmental conditions. 

2-prong AC plugs are a standard offering used across the power industry worldwide. Your situation may differ, but most folks have seen or operate with 2-prong adapters and have no issues.

In some regions they are even required (such as Japan). The ability to form tingle is just part of this class of adapter.

Teddi Dunson said:
I believe you will find that this affects people with a higher level of  static electricity in thier body. The higher their level the more tingle. It affects other things besides the laptops and two prong plugs.
Still no Vista Express Upgrade.  :(  Holy crap you guys dropped the ball on this one.
David said:
I wonder why, when I emailed Dell Australia telling them I had found this "stray voltage", they sent out a new adapter without me even asking for one, free of charge I might add. I received it 2 days later...obviously they felt I needed one...
Kelleigh - New Zealand said:
maybe you can sell the 2 prong... stock standard.. and have the 3 prong as a feature upgrade, just like you do the 512mb ram upgraded to 1g ram...so you pay just a little more for this.. perhaps when you sell it you ask if the user will be using a printer then the 2 prong can be pushed to buy when they say they wont be pluged into a printer for majority.. i think only laptop users feel this tingle sensation. We cant control the weather.. and we all have unique skin types, and laptops are purchased for the portable factor... with this in mind weather could change no matter where we take it.  Thats just some ideas on the matter.
Shawn said:
I have a problem when I use my laptop in my car. On battery power, i can patch my laptop audio thru to my cars Aux input on the stereo with no problems. works great. However, if I do that when I have the laptop pluged into my power inverter, I get a loud buzzing coming thru the speakers. I'm puzzled by it, and the buzzing sounds like a ground problem to me. Considering the laptop is NOT grounded with it being only 2 prong (the invertor is 3 prong), this seems to be my issue. I'm going to run some more tests to verify that it is a laptop issue and not an amp issue, but this seems like a good lead. I would be very interested in getting a 3 prong if this is in fact my problem.
Glen T said:

I stumbled on this stray voltage issue while I was trying to find out why my Inspiron 9400 had suffered 2 hard drive failures in 9 months. I had also had video card problems.

I measured 45 volts AC at 250 to 300 milliamps from the case screws of my 9400 when it was plugged in, but not turned on.

I noticed that I would often get static shocks when I touched the case of my 9400 while wearing rubber soled shoes in a warm, moist coastal climate. I wondered why I often got static shocks while plugging in USB devices (in fact, I killed a new USB thumb drive this way).

I theorized, that without a good ground path, these static discharges could seek a path through internal electronic components rather than directly to ground. The ungrounded power supply seemed to offer one possible explanation for these component failures.

Despite the comments of Dell experts, I wonder whether the ungrounded power supplies have had some negative impact on Inspiron reliability. I note also that Dell seems to be in the process of raising their 2nd and 3rd year extended warranty rates, as I found out today when I purchased an extension for my 9400.

Having said all that, I feel I should point out that "laptops" are so named because people often use them, well, in their laps. People don't hold hair dryers or electric clocks or desktop computers in their laps for hours when they are using them. This is an important distinction.

Tingle = stray voltage passing through your body. I have left any concerns about my fertility in my past. But maybe young gamers should consider a lead blanket if they are going to play for a few hours with an ungrounded 120v machine on their knees?

Sven Sweden said:

It would be nice if you could offer a three prong adapter as an option.

 

If it’s not a manufacturing problem then I would guess that every 9400 /1705 is affected!?

Some people state that they don’t have this problem. Is that just by coincidence?

 

All electrical devices, including notebooks, printers, PDAs, etc., powered by AC Adapters with a two-pronged power cord (without a ground wire) may exhibit an electrical potential (voltage) between the exposed metal parts of the device and earth ground.”

 

They may but I have only found one that do.

 

Ole Jensen said:
Dell meets or surpasses all applicable standards with all of our notebook and desktop systems. The logos of the applicable regulatory and safety agencies for the Dell notebook power adapters can be found on the AC adapter power brick and include the FCC, UL, CCC S&E, CSA, CE, IDA, IRAM, GS, NOM and a few others.

Come on, let's be honest. Dell likely buys off-the-shell power adapters from OEMs in bulk (Dell branded or generic). Likely, Dell doesn't engineer them, but just provides a specification, and then goes for the lowest bidder. Power adapters are commodity mass products, "no one" builds their own any more these days . Likely, dell does not itself check compliance to the alphabet soup of safety logos. Dell probably checks from time to time the paperwork provided by the supplier. Or maybe Dell doesn't bother and just trusts the supplier.

It is not unheard of that security logos on devices are blatant fakes, that certificates have been faked, or that the product is no longer build the way it was tested and certified. Not talking about manufacturers producing cheap unsafe counterfeit copies of original safe equipment.

So, just claiming a product is save because it is full of safety logos and safety agency names is utter nonsense. What is your safety team really doing to guarantee the safety of the adapters? Just looking at safety logos and nodding? Believing the certificates provided by the supplier? When was the last time that some independent test lab (independent from Dell and the manufacturer) has gotten a random sample of the currently shipped adapters and checked and measured if they are what they are supposed to be?

Jim Seippel, Manager—Dell Product Safety said:

Ole Jensen: Thanks for your comment. I have firsthand experience of the kind of testing Dell does to ensure product safety, and wanted to respond.

AC adapters used on Dell products are designed to work only with Dell products. Dell has internal specifications for AC adapters that exceed industry requirements. Dell also uses internal product safety specifications to ensure that AC adapters surpass safety standards. They are not purchased “off the shelf.”

Before an AC adapter design is approved for use with a Dell product, it must go through rigorous Dell testing and also pass testing by third parties. All AC adapter designs are verified to comply with world-wide safety and EMC standards and are certified by multiple independent certification agencies. This is evidenced by the regulatory and safety marks that can be found on the AC adapted label. These marks include FCC, UL, CCC S&E, CSA, CE, IDA, IRAM, GS, and NOM.

Dell has a staff of regulatory engineers that are qualified by safety agencies for their knowledge and experience. Dell regulatory engineers review every AC adapter design for compliance with world-wide requirements and also for compliance with Dell’s internal product safety and technical requirements. This review ensures that nothing was missed by outside regulatory agencies. Each AC adapter design is then subjected to internal Dell testing to verify compliance. In addition Dell requires that an independent third party lab verifies compliance to Dell specifications. Each adapter design must pass Dell’s rigorous requirements before they can be used on Dell products.

The net result is that Dell AC adapters exceed industry requirements and are safe for their intended use and foreseeable misuse. Dell takes the safety of all Dell products seriously.

Glen T said:
In terms of health issues, another thought occurred to me. I certainly would not want to use one of these notebooks in the standard reclining-in-bed-while-using-laptop-on-chest position if I had a pacemaker. But then, maybe there's a lot of things I wouldn't do if I had a pacemaker installed...
Brad Willet said:
I am more concerned about the infamous "NMI / Parity Error" BSOD that many claim disappears or is reduced when using a grounded adapter.  I have had my e1705 for about 6 months now, and it is not dependable due to this problem that many others experience with the same model.  I've swapped memory modules with another E1705 owner and still had the same issue (while he does not), and I've also had my MB replaced.  I never know when the BSOD is going to happen, and it always passes the Dell Diagnostics (included the extended memory test).  If using the non-grounded AC adapter causes memory parity errors, I am greatly concerned about diminished component life.  I've read every post in the notebookforums.com thread, and many others share my concerns.  It's bad enough that I spent $2k USD on an unreliable laptop, but even worse knowing that I'm stuck with it and that components may start crapping out after the warranty is over. 
Drew said:
[quote]For existing customers, we’re currently investigating creating a program to make 3-prong power adapters available for purchase at a discounted price. We need your help, and that’s why we’re asking customers who are interested in acquiring a 3-prong power adapter to provide additional feedback via this survey on Dell.com. The survey will run from now until Monday, May 7.[/quote]

This is absurd.  Having to purchase a component so that my laptop doesn't shock me when I use it in my lap is a joke.  Whether or not there is any current coming off of the laptop is immaterial.  I don't want to feel a "tingle" when I use something in my lap that is designed for use in my lap.  Along the same lines I don't wife to feel a zap when she touches me or tries to kiss me while I work on my laptop.  Plain and simple this is a flaw.  This should have been taken care of before any of these laptops shipped. 

I have purchased 4 laptops in the last 4 years from Dell and in the past I have been pretty quick to recommend Dell computers to friends and family.  I've mostly had good luck with the systems I've owned and greatly appreciate the warranty protection that Dell offers (even if customer service is the worst thing that I have ever encountered and am likely to encounter during my life time).  But I'm afraid that I can no longer suggest a company that has such complete disregard for it's customers that it doesn't care if they are receiving electric shocks by using the product in it's intended way.  No wonder Dell is losing market share.

It looks as though the 10+ computers that were to be sold to my friends and family in the next year and half will all be going elsewhere.

I sure am glad that I get discounts to most of the major computer manufacturers through my work.
 

Alfred said:

I notice the tingle on the d820 and not on my m1710.

I notice it more when I accidentally touch the d820 with the inside part of my forearm on the corners, I guess it is more sensitive..

 

drew said:

"For existing customers, we’re currently investigating creating a program to make 3-prong power adapters available for purchase at a discounted price. We need your help, and that’s why we’re asking customers who are interested in acquiring a 3-prong power adapter to provide additional feedback via this survey on Dell.com. The survey will run from now until Monday, May 7."

This is absurd. Having to purchase a component so that my laptop doesn't shock me when I use it in my lap is a joke. Whether or not there is any current coming off of the laptop is immaterial. I don't want to feel a "tingle" when I use something in my lap that is designed for use in my lap. Along the same lines I don't wife to feel a zap when she touches me or tries to kiss me while I work on my laptop. Plain and simple this is a flaw. This should have been taken care of before any of these laptops shipped.


I have purchased 4 laptops in the last 4 years from Dell and in the past I have been pretty quick to recommend Dell computers to friends and family. I've mostly had good luck with the systems I've owned and greatly appreciate the warranty protection that Dell offers (even if customer service is the worst thing that I have ever encountered and am likely to encounter during my life time). But I'm afraid that I can no longer suggest a company that has such complete disregard for it's customers that it doesn't care if they are receiving electric shocks by using the product in it's intended way. No wonder Dell is losing market share.

It looks as though the 10+ computers that were to be sold to my friends and family in the next year and half will all be going elsewhere.

I sure am glad that I get discounts to most of the major computer manufacturers through my work.

Bryan Blake said:

If you are looking for IEC320 C7 (Clover Leaf) replacement cords and adapters you can find them here at MCM Electronics.

6' IEC320 C7 Power Cord 

 http://tinyurl.com/3bb4a5

IEC320 C7 to IEC320 C5 (Round) adapter
 http://tinyurl.com/3dlnsk

 

Thanks,

 Bryan
 

Mark said:

Dell will just quietly offer it as an option to those who complain since they likely wouldn't want the negative publicity backlash if every internet forum, computer website, and new site, had the headline saying: "Dell Recalling 20 Million 2-Prong Ungrounded Laptop Power Cords That Cause Your Laptop To Shock You And Offering Replacement Grounded 3-Prong Versions That Should Have Been Provided In The First Place". 

Than again, since many are complaining, the headlines may read: "Dell Refusing To Recall 20 Million 2-Prong Ungrounded Laptop Power Cords That Cause Your Laptop To Shock You And Instead Are Requiring Customers To Pay For Replacement Grounded 3-Prong Versions That Should Have Been Provided In The First Place". 

I hope Dell takes the high road and offers replacements free of charge.  Geez, when the whole exploding battery fiasco happened, the battery manufacturer, Sony, owned up to their problem and replaced millions of defective batteries for all the major computer manufacturers.  This is no different, and Dell should fix their mistake. 

D a v e said:
I want 3 prong and Dell should buy!
Matt said:

I think it's prepostorous how Dell is addressing this issue.  Ole Jensen asked, "What is your safety team really doing to guarantee the safety of the adapters? Just looking at safety logos and nodding?"  And Jim Seippel answers by saying

  • Dell AC adapters are designed to work according to Dell specifications.
  • The design goes through rigorous testing.
  • Adapter designs are verified to comply with safety standards.
  • Dell engineers review the designs of every adapter.
  •  Each design is tested by Dell to verify compliance.
  • The evidence for all this is in the safety marks.

Not a single word about testing the actual products after the design has been put into production.  Not a single word affirming or denying that they spot check deliveries from their supplier.

People with pacemakers, indeed.  I can see the Saturday Night Live skit now: "Dude, you're getting a BZZZZZZZZZZZT!!!!!!!!!"

Dell is run now by MBAs who care only about counting beans and squeezing every last dime out of their customers.  Customer service is a necessary evil to them, and nothing more.  Everything you need to know about Dell is contained in Mr. Seippel's resonse.  The key is not what he said, it's what he didn't say.  Look at how many times he used the word "design", and the stark absence of anything even remotely related to actual testing of actual physical components.

Shorter Dell: "It's not a problem.  So you get a little shock from electricity that's leaking out from someplace we don't quite have a handle on.  The design was good.  Trust us.  Look at all the logos."

You know, I want to take part in something that will let me look back on the name "Dell" in a few years and smile.  I bet the Dell PR flacks have been working frantically for the last few weeks to come up with the exact language of the press release that announces the recall.  I bet the MBAs are frantically looking for a way to avoid a recall.  I bet safety concerns are at the bottom of the priority list with this issue.   I would bet money on it.  In fact, I will when the stock market opens on Monday.

I hope having read this blog doesn't constitute insider information, because it's almost as good as having it.

Christof Chen said:

I am interested in receiving a 3-prong power adapter.

Best regards,

    Christof Chen 

Glen T said:

I think that what I'm hearing from Dell is that as far as ungrounded power supplies are concerned, Dell's are as good as anyones. So be it.

The problem seems to be that ungrounded power supplies, when used with some Dell notebook products, may lead to higher current leakage than would be experienced if these same notebooks were used with grounded power supplies. Anecdotal evidence from customers who have used both seems to indicate that this is true.

The problem could actually be the shielding in the notebook itself. The question should be: was the notebook designed for an ungrounded power supply?

Beyond issues of the impact of current leakage on reliablity of the notebook, is this dangerous? Well, under certain circumstances, it must be dangerous to some individuals (exampe: pacemakers). If you can feel it (and Dell acknowledges that this problem is real) then current leakage exists.

Mike Bukowski, Channel Liaison said:

Glen,

Thank you for bringing your concerns forward. To address them respectively, it is voltage being read from the bottom of the notebook system when certain environmental conditions exist. This issue is not just with Dell notebook systems; there have been reports from customers using other manufacturer’s notebooks as well.

The tingle doesn’t stem from the shielding, it stems from the AC adapter when certain external environmental conditions are present. And yes, the notebooks were designed to work with our non earth grounded 2-prong adapters. Dell has been very clear about this from the start. The safety issue was the very first concern that we addressed. The tingle is within industry standard guidelines. These guidelines were developed by the federal government and other 3rd party regulatory agencies, not Dell. Dell takes the initiative to add extra safety features in our adapters that help us exceed these guidelines to provide an even safer setup for our consumers.

SRed said:
Please e-mail me details on the 3-prong power adapter.
Colin Jones said:

I find it quite bizarre that a problem that has seemingly not affected large numbers of other Dell laptops is met with the comments that just because this one does it is a perfectly normal thing to happen.

How many different models have Dell sold with two prong adapters over the years, why has this only become an issue with these laptops Inspirion 6400 and 9400 it seems (not sure of others?)

Why should I have to buy something that shields me and the laptop from static which any designer should know can be fairly deadly to IT equipment. (maybe Dell could sell a static wristband for its users instead?)

The survey is now over so I presume I will be contacted via the e-mail I leave from this post.

 

(I have no idea if my laptop in the UK is affected (we have a 3 prong wall socket plug but the lead from the laptop to the brick is two prong) 

 

 

Mark Ryan Miller said:

Please send me details about replacement three prong adapter.  Thank you.

I do agree with other comments that Dell needs to address this as replacement.  This is a PR issue.  I am current an MBA myself, and I can tell you that Dell's MBA's were asleep in class when they discussed "lifetime customer value". 

I am also an IT consultant who recommends and purchases equipment.  I used to suggest Dell, but am not sure about the quality anymore.  I purchased a M1210 back in September with several issues (power supply making noise, hum on audio when using the power supply, and buzz coming from the motherboard).  Thank goodness I bought a 3 year service warranty.  The only reason I haven't called yet is because I'm extremely busy, and don't want to deal with the terrible Dell support.

Glen T said:

Mike Bukowski, you impatience seems to be showing a little. You emphasize that people may experience tingling when certain environmental conditions exist . But this is not the point.

The point is that the significant current leakage exists and can be measured between the notebook case and a ground source under any environmental conditions. You are treating a symptom as thought it was a cause. In other words: no tingle = no problem. This is wrong.

Yesterday a story broke in the general press about a study that shows that a popular personal music player (yes, that popular player) can cause problems with pacemakers. As a result, doctors are now warning patients to not use these players in their shirt pockets.

My Inspiron 9400 put out 250 to 300 milliamps at AC 45 volts. This is way more power than any personal music player can possibly put out. Do you not think that a significant potential exists for a catastrophic event, if a user with a pacemarker inadvertently used one of your ungrounded products when certain environmental conditions exist ?

Exactly how much testing has Dell done with pacemakers and other sensitive electronic medical devices and Dell ungrounded AC powered portable computing devices?

Glen T said:

Regarding availablity of 3-prong adapters at a discounted price: I would like to share the following correspondence that I had with the Executive Support office of Dell Canada on March 26, 2007:

"I wanted to address the issue with the power supply/power cord.  I spoke to one of our senior technical agents on site here, and the Inspiron 9400 (to his knowledge) is now only manufactured with a 3-prong adapter.  With that, the new unit, should be coming to you with a 3-prong power adapter."

I subsequently received two, 2-prong adapters with my replacement 9400, not the 3-prong adapters that were promised. Given the statement above, would it be reasonable to ask that you provide me with two 3-prong adapters at no charge? Note that I originally purchased two adapters because I split my time between two offices.

Chris said:

It's obvious that there is a problem. Failure after failure occurs with the two prong. Switch to a 3 prong and everything works fine. I went through 4 sticks of RAM then I purchased a 3-prong and haven't had a problem since. GIVE ME A BREAK. I have been working in the field for a while. I have not seen any company skirt around an issue this much since the Compaq EP 400 Matrox video card issue.

 I will not be ordering from Dell again. Dell has lost my trust. I will also pass along this tale to all clients and relations and let them make their own decisions.

Really even a postive outcome from this point while relavent will not be enough to win my trust.

 

Anand sancheti said:
I have the same issue and my adapter some times beeps too.
Menez Chapleau said:

Please e-mail me details on the 3-prong power adapter.

Thank you.

 PS : Am currently investigating ways to resolve "NMI Memory parity error" I often get. These errors started a couple weeks after I got my 6400, back in June 2006. Happens once-twice a week. Talked to several technicians since then, did all the tests : everything seems okay. Will call the tech again tomorrow. Am extremely annoyed with this problem. As it is, my data is not safe on this Dell. I just hope the 3-prong power adapter will finally make my computer work the way it should!

Glen T said:

Can a PA-1131-02D three-prong power supply (Inspiron 5150) be used on the Inspiron 9400? I just found one in our pile of spare parts.

Glen T said:

Update 5/8: Thanks to all of you who completed the survey. Unfortunately, in the survey, we neglected to obtain contact information from you. If you completed the survey and are interested in receiving a 3-prong power adapter for a discounted price, please submit a comment to this thread and include your e-mail address. I will not publish your comment. Instead, we will e-mail you details on how to order your discounted 3-prong power adapter. We apologize for the inconvenience.

-------

Can a PA-1131-02D three-prong power supply (Inspiron 5150) be used on the Inspiron 9400? I just found one in our pile of spare parts.

-------

"I wanted to address the issue with the power supply/power cord.  I spoke to one of our senior technical agents on site here, and the Inspiron 9400 (to his knowledge) is now only manufactured with a 3-prong adapter.  With that, the new unit, should be coming to you with a 3-prong power adapter."

I subsequently received two, 2-prong adapters with my replacement 9400, not the 3-prong adapters that were promised. Given the statement above, would it be reasonable to ask that you provide me with two 3-prong adapters at no charge?

------

No response received to the above, as of May 29.

Todd said:

I just found this page, so I didn't fill out the survey, but I am very interested in getting a 3-prong AC adapter.  I have called Dell a few times but customer service has been no help to me, completely unwilling to acknowledge any problem or provide any solution.  Please send me more details, as I would much appreciate getting a discounted 3-prong AC adapter (I would have preferred if Dell would just own up to the problems and send them for free).

One other thing:  One of the above comments indicated that in some regions (such as Japan) the two-prong version was required.  Why is this?  Is it a sign of safety somehow that your product doesn't need a 3-prong adapter?  I guess, given some of my international power adapters, that some regions may not even support this.
 

Harry Nashed said:
re: "please submit a comment to this thread and include your e-mail address. I will not publish your comment. Instead, we will e-mail you details on how to order your discounted 3-prong power adapter."

Thanks in advance for sending me information on purchasing the 3-prong power adapter.
Brandon Watts said:
I too just stumbled on this thread and have been having the problems mentioned by others.  Can I get the information on the discounted 3-prong adapters please?  Thanks -
Chris said:
Are there any updates from a Dell representative?  I would rather not get shocked. 
sparky said:

hi, please send me details of how to get a replacement brick to power my i9k4.  an engineer is calling here tomorrow to replace lots of internals but i have no faith it will be a long-term solution so i want an earthed power supply as insurance.  what a mess you're in dell!  :( 

 

 

Glen T said:
Looks like this thread (and the suggested power supply replacement program) are as dead as the Inspiron 9400 appears to be...
Bill Westerman said:
I just stumbled onto this forum and would like to get a 3-prong power cord to replace the current 2-prong on my Dell Inspiron.  I have had an automatic implantable cardioverter defibrillator implanted in my abdomen since 1993 (actually on my third device - batteries only last a few years) when I developed a serious heart arrhythmia due to infection from Lyme Disease.  I have been having some strange things happening lately while using my Dell in the in-bed  laptop-on-my-chest position.  I completely forgot about the potential for electrical interference between the two devices and have discontinued such use, but would still like to get a three pronged connector.  Please advise.  thanks much.
Lawrence Barling said:

Have a D820 purchased in April and have this problem... is the discounted power adapter still available - thanks

Jean-Louis Dupond said:
And my second Inspiron 9400 died again ... 4 months old .. Great DELL :(
Justin Broad said:

Please let me know how I can get a 3 prong power adapter for my XPS M1710. Thanks...

E Bankston said:

Hi Folks,

I remain vendor neutral in most cases. All vendors have their moments. I would be frustrated and have been frustrated with several vendors for what appears to be a fault.  There are expenses associated with any RMA or product fix.  However, vendors must realize that it is much cheaper to handle the exceptions than a class action suit. But since the lawyers are already paid in most cases, they look to legally get out of it, not morally. What is lost customer loyalty worth. though?

Unlike the Sony battery replacement, where Sony picked up the tab of operations, the power adapter vendor is more than likely meeting of exceeding specifications for the device. This removes any liability from the manufacturer of the specifications as it is now up to the consumer of the adapter to insure that the use prevents the accidental discharge that may build up. 

The simple statement about connecting a printer to act as a ground source and getting a zap, indicates to me that all metal components in the case are sharing the same ground potential.  And in most cases, this is a good thing.  However, this potential is just not at zero.  So when you connect a USB connector, the only way you can "prevent" an accidental discharge in  a USB storage device, is to be contact a metal component already to insure that you and the computer are at the same ptential.

Someone indicated the loss of components attributing this to this issue.  This may be a heat issue or something else, since the internal components should not feel the discharge at the exit points.  If it is heat, it may be that the drive does not ever shut off. The extended heat from the hotter CPU's. faster graphics cards and memory, often combine to shortent the life of components. There are manufacturers that had to slow the graphics card's clock to reduce heat within the case. Laptops were meant to be used 2-3 hours at a time and not left on 24 hrs a day.  I work in IT, and when users leave the laptops on their desks and never shut them off, then a lot of the corporate "spies" or software "updaters" are always causing the systems to continuously hit the hard drives, and hence never shut down.  This causes the laptops to become warmer than normal and I have seen quite a number of premature disk failures occurring.

Dell, I neither applaud you, nor admonish you.  However, I suggest that you consider what was put forth.


Michael said:
I would like to buy one.
Goyal said:
I would like to buy one too.
Saiful Molla said:
I purchased a Dell Inspiron 1450 laptop 5 years ago that came with a 3 prong power adaptor and have not had any problems. I am surprised the 2 prong is now the standard. I plan to purchase my next laptop (seriously considering the xps 1330) and hope the power adaptor has 3 prongs. It is easier to convert from a 3 prong to 2 prong with a simple attachement so I'd rather have the 3 prong. I do hate the tingling feeling.
iDell said:
Mac notebooks come with both plugs. Dell should include them for free.
Dennis said:

I would like one. maybe it wll fix the error ive been getting on my m1330:

*** Hardware Malfunction
Call your hardware vendor for support
NMI: Parity Check/Memory Parity Error
*** The system has halted ***

could someone look into this? seems like alot of people have this issue across the spectrum of dell laptops

James McIntosh said:
I would be interested in a new adapter, I'm getting tired on the continued "shocks"
John Pruitt said:

After 3 months fighting with the "System Halted" Blue screen, Dell finally agreed to give my money back.  I had first called them 3 days after I took delivery.  They sent out new MB and new Memory.  Still did not fix issue.

On 9-14-07 Dell agreed to give me a full refund and gave me an RMA number.  My unit is the E1705 and it has the 3 prong power adapter.  I am thinking either an IBM Think Pad handled by Lenevo now or an Apple. I just need something reliable.

Theresa Daguman said:

I believe you owe users a 3-prong adapter for FREE, and not just discounted.

This is the proper way to keep your business and your loyal customers. I have a DELL 710m so please send a 3 prong adapter.


 

J.Routledge said:

I can't believe what I've just read above.

 Electrical equipment is NOT supposed to give out any kind of 'Tingle' or 'Electric Shock' and I can't believe the excuses Dell are making to justify this problem. I discovered this blog while trying to solve an electric shock problem on a Latitude D620 with a 3 pin mains psu, which I am expecting to be a traceable and repairable fault, and hopefully not a series of excuses and fob offs. Dell laptop batteries only appear to give a 30min runtime when they're 6 months old too, yet Dell won't replace these as a warranty repair either.

Lionel Menchaca, Chief Blogger said:

J. Routledge: Sorry for the problems you've had with your laptop. Will ask someone from Tech Support to contact you.

Simon said:

Dell's position seems to be that its systems and power supplies may give harmless but unpleasant electric shocks to users under some circumstances by design.  It is clear from the comments here that many users have the expectation that consumer products will not give an electric shock on contact with the casing under any circumstances (except hardware failure, in which case it should be replaced under warranty).  I should hope that Dell would take the feedback on board and design all future products not to give electric shocks.  In the meantime, might I ask that Dell prominently advertise this 'feature' on the product description and configuration pages on its website for all affected products?  Perhaps: 'This system is designed to give the user harmless electric shocks under some environmental conditions' would be appropriate.  At least then potential customers can make an informed purchasing decision.

Lionel Menchaca, Chief Blogger said:

Simon: Thanks for your feedback. Just so you know, I recently added an updated post on this topic. You can read it here.

The reality is that any notebook with a two-wire adapter can exhibit this tingle under certain environmental conditions. This tingle is a different thing than static electricity.

David Gabler said:

Laptop Inspiron e1505.  One for me and a duplicate for my wife.  we BOTH get shocked from the laptop when standing up from the couch.  These shocks HURT.  They are worse than static electricity shocks, well about as bad a very strong static shock.  The shock typically comes from a screw on the bottom of the laptop near the headphone/sd slot.  This is because this is where you hand is.  We are using the three prong (90w) version of power chargers.

Lionel Menchaca, Chief Blogger said:

David: Sorry to see that your Inspiron 1505 is causing some problems. I will ask someone from Tech Support to contact you so we can get to the bottom of the issue you describe.

Hoa But said:

 Hello,

 I bought two dell xps m1330s.  I would like to obtain two 3-prong AC adapters for both xps m1330s.

 Please contact me about the details.  It would be ideal if they are free upgrades.

 
Thank you.


 

Jim Watt said:

 I just purchased a D630 and it has this problem.  Please send me details about the replacement power assembly.

RB said:

Just read the "revisited" post about his subject here:
http://direct2dell.com/one2one/archive/2008/01/18/41538.aspx 

If it's not too late to find out about a discount three-prong, I'd like one for my new XPS M1530.   Please advise.

Thank you. 

Geoff said:

 I would like to purchase one also.

Lionel Menchaca, Chief Blogger said:

Hoa, Jim, RB, and Geoff: Thanks for your comments. I've asked someone from our Technical Support teams to contact you both.

For further discussion, you can also visit this Dell Community Forum thread that I referenced in my updated post on this topic.

Sal G said:

Oh dear,

What a horrible thing! I was seriously considering buying and XPS notebook as it looked so sleek and was value for money. And I heard that Dell had good after-sales service. But thankfully I read up a bit more and discovered this 'shock' issue. Won't be buying a Dell after all. Hello Sony VAIO...

Gordon Muir said:

Dell, whether you have a user problem or a percieved problem - I for one will not buy another Dell laptop in the near future because of the way Dell have handled this problem. Taking a survey over several months is a joke. The small outlay it would cost Dell to supply free of charge an earthed adapter to any laptop user experiencing problems would be more comensorate with the customer service that Dell purchasers are accustomed to. This would have turned a negative into a positive.

This was a small probem that should have been hastily dealt with, instead this has been drawn out to a major saga, turning a small negative into a customer losing fiasco.

 

UK USER said:

Does this effect UK users who always have an earth by default on their plugs?

Lionel Menchaca, Chief Blogger said:

UK user: It's not just the plug, it depends on the type of power adapter you have. If you have a two-wire adapter, you may experience the tingle eeven if you have an earth default at the wall. But, even then, this tingle can only be felt by some people under environmental conditions,

In other words, the tingle does not happen with a three-wire AC adapter.

Todd said:

I picked up a M1530 last week in the UK (so about the 15/01/08) and it has been doing it out of the box. I could not decide if it was the feeling of the brushed aluminum or a real buzz...

They say it can't harm you:
http://www.dellcommunity.com/supportforums/board/message?board.id=Tech_Talk_XPS_Laptop&thread.id=2719
http://direct2dell.com/one2one/archive/2007/04/24/8522.aspx

Rubber gloves maybe :)

I am not sure that it can't harm you. If it is not earthed correctly can't some sort of charge build up and then give you a 'belt'!
 

 


 

John S. said:

Are you seriously saying that Dell connects the chassis ground of the laptop to the AC "common" pin inside of their 2-prong AC power adapters?

You really need to get some education for your electrical engineers regarding the differences between "0 Volts", "ground", and "common".  Perhaps by having them hold a common wire from a loaded circuit under their  tongue with a ground wire wrapped around their ankle.

 

John S. said:

I just checked my 2-prong Dell power adapter, and it is not wired with DC ground connected to the common pin.  Otherwise when plugged into a GFCI outlet with the DC ground ring contacting a water pipe, it would have tripped the outlet's GFCI breaker. 

My laptop does not shock (or, ahem, "tingle") me either.

So was there a design change, or could you elaborate more on the conditions that lead to current leakage between the DC side and AC side of the power adapter?

Surely the adapter could have been designed to provide better isolation under those conditions?  The conditions seem to be common enough that there are plenty of people complaining about getting shocked.

 

Nicholas said:

Hi Lionel Menchaca,

I would also like to be contacted regarding the "3 pronge". Thank you in advance.

I would also comment on what you wrote about the tingle sensation: You wrote that this is normal and it won't harm the users, nor the internal hardware. But be honest. This is WRONG. I don't like to touch a thing that gives me tingling problem every day, every second. It is just not pleasant for me to feel that sensation. It may be normal for DELL, but it isn't for me. We have many devices with metal surface (or aluminum), but we did not face this "normal bahaviuor" in the past! I don't have a cell phone with tingeling sensation, I don't have a remote control with that sensation ´, and I don't LIKE that sensation.

What I am trying to say is, for the sake of god, try to look at this issue from user's eyes. Do you really like to own a mobile phone with tingeling sensation? and do you really like it, when your mobile company tells you that this is normal and you may live with it because it won't harm you OR you may have to pay for it to fix it?

Lionel Menchaca, Chief Blogger said:

Nicholas: I have asked someone from Technical Support to contact you.

I'm not suggesting that the tingle sensation will happen constantly. The reality is that it may be felt by some people with two-wire adapters when certain environmental conditions are met.

In other words, the tingle may happen occasionally for some customers with two-wire adapters.  

Albert said:

I cannot believe i may have to pay for this... but i cannot stand this "tingle" or random shocks anymore fix this dell............ this is an issue not just a "it wont kill you so why should we fix it thing..." 

Douglas Cox said:

What is the status on this issue Dell?  I cannot believe that there isn't even a replacement part available in the US yet.  It is obvious this problem has been know to exist for quite some time.  I will be emailing CNET to ask that they do a follow-up on this issue in the US as they seem to have been able to get a replacement part where they were located.

Mick said:

My Dell D820 has the same tingle. The reason for this is the metal in the laptop shell/casing.

Plastic cannot transfer the tingle, plastic is an electrical insulator not a conductor.

 

It is not related to a "bad earth". It is releted to the device not being earthed at all!

Tips: Do not touch the laptop casing and your microwave oven (or any other metallic appliances with 2 prong adaptors) at the same time... Zap. Specially with the softer parts of your body (Inside forearm, tongue etc).

Do not wear acrylic shoes on carpeted areas and then touch the device. Zap.

Airconditioning may also lead to the tingle due to the lack of humidity in airconditioned spaces. Keep the space well ventilated with "natural" air if possible.

Replacing the 2 prong plug with a 3 prong plug generally only works if the 3 prong plug's earth prong is connected... duh.

wayne fallows said:

Please send me details of the discounted ( should be free) 3 prong adapter. I'm a suffering the tingle, and it is not a pleasnt experiance, I will be returning my laptop if this is not dealth with quickly.

aue84fr said:

I have this tingle sensation on sector as well as on battery (less powerful but still here)...

I think thus, it has nothing to do with a 3-pin power adapter. The fault comes from the non insulated aluminium panel below the keyboard. Moreover many people are experiencing a corrosion issue on this aluminium which is due to a bad anodisation of the aluminium.

Sorry but a 3-pin power adapter will just smooth the problem, not solve it entirely. This is cheaper to send new adapter than send back the computer... cost reduction management...

Regards,

John Hiratsuka said:

My stepson was shocked by his dell Inspiron 600m and his screen is now scrambled. He was told today that this is not going to be covered by warrantee. I am not pleased at all.

Joanne Hamann, Direct2Dell Tool Admin said:

John,

I am sorry to hear of your frustration. I am sending  you an email requesting additional informaiton.

Joanne

Richard Price said:

I have just received my replacement XPS 1530. The Hard drive failed in the first machine after 2 hours use. I complained at the tingle and was told I could have a replacement power supply. Now my replacement 1530 has arrived. With the tingle and still only a 2 wire supply. I told customer support and was sent on a 1 hour runaround in technical support. Nobody at Dell technical support had heard of this tingle problem ! last week.

There appears to be Dell company policy to hide from this. My time is too valuable to waste in business hours to be fobbed off on a known problem. Like others in this thread I have been a longtime Dell user. I am astounded at the attitude. 

If there is a stray voltage problem and my first hard drive fails after 2 hours how can I trust my livelihood to such a product ? 

I dont think the XPS 1530 is going to be a success for me. Prove me wrong by making some response that answers the issues in a responsible manner.

Richard Price   

  

 

 

 

 

John Hickey said:

Please send me information on the the 3 prong adapter.  I can't stand the shocks anymore.  I have the M1210.

Joanne Hamann, Direct2Dell Tool Admin said:

Sorry to hear of your issue. I am escalating this issue.

 Joanne

Milbert Bayot said:

 Please send me information on the the 3 prong adapter for the M1530.  Thanks

Virgil said:

Hi,

I just got a new M1330 and I feel the "tingle" even when its not plugged into the power.

<